Yes, there’s more to Newtonville than just Austin Street. At @fignewtonville’s request, here’s an opportunity to discuss last night’s Parks & Recreation Commission public hearing. At issue was a proposal to build a parking lot on public park land to provide enhanced staff parking for a renovated Cabot School. I was unable to attend. Can anyone share what went on and what opinions were expressed? Was a parking study presented? Were new alternatives presented?
Cabot School site and parking options
Minutes from last month’s meeting provide some good background. As with the Angier and Zervas School projects, the new design aims to increase on-site staff parking. Once again, the school site is extremely constrained. Most of the available space it appears will paved to accommodate vehicles. In addition to a bus loop, multiple drop-off loops will enable parents to drop off their child by car a very short distance from the building. (Drop-off loops have created chaos at other Newton schools, and a similar proposal at Zervas was nixed) The renovation plan would build a gymnasium on what is now the end of Parkview Ave, terminating the road and connecting the park to the school property. That part of Parkview, ironically, has traditionally been used for parking, creating a view of… parked cars.
The proposal seeks to build a lot which extends into Cabot Park. Is this the right use of the available open space? What is the likely outcome of such a car-centric site design?
I do not know the outcome of last night’s meeting. However, I use the park regularly for recreation. I believe that to take park land for teacher parking is a mistake and not beneficial to the general good of the community.
In my neighborhood close to the Carr school, I have noticed a significant negative impact on neighborhood streets due to school overflow parking. Carr has 2 lots and enough parking for 70 vehicles which is sufficient for staff. Still visitors to the school park in the nearby streets and are causing safety problems at busy nearby intersections.
I ask why so many extra cars? There is plenty of parking for staff.
As for Cabot, I believe the parkland should not be compromised by another place for more cars.
Colleen,
Angier has encouraged parents to volunteer. We volunteer weekly in the library. We volunteer to assist teachers in and out of the classroom. We have parent teacher meetings. We have PTO meetings. None of the parents are allowed to park in the Angier at Carr parking lot. We are a community, and our community is now at Carr, and we can’t walk there (or take the T there), so we are forced to drive. When I park in front of a house in the neighborhood, I know I am parking in front of a residential house, who might be expecting visitors, but I don’t have a choice. I can’t walk from to Carr from the Highlands, and I can’t take the D line one stop. I have to drive.
The Parks and Rec Commission voted 5 yes – 1 no – 1 abstention for the “no lot” option (which has 28 head-in spaces but no interior lot).
The chamber was full. The public hearing was spirited.
What are the options for public transportation to the site?
Simon, the Newtonville MBTA stop is half a mile away, as are the 52 & 59 buses.
Austin Street Partners has publicly pledged $100K for Hubway bike share. A station on Walnut street and one near Cabot School would faciliate the last 1/2 mile trip from transit and connect nicely to the existing Boston network. Disclaimer: Not everyone…
On-street parking is a shared public resource, not private property. Considering the cost of real estate and the impact of paving over more land to store cars, one might say on street parking is quite valuable. Parking strategies can try to mitigate the impact of staff parking or spread it out, and there is potentially other parking available, both on and off site. Shouldn’t we examine all these possibilities before claiming park land?
Nathan and Simon:
Sounds good on a blog post, but not really reality for a school. Teacher aides service multiple schools. Parent volunteers come from work (that’s me!). Any school needs some amount of parking, and the parking around Cabot has always been awful. AWFUL.
Let’s examine why. Some of this is the city’s incompetence. Sidewalks around the school are never plowed. I walk them with my kids. Until I couldn’t because they weren’t plowed. This is EVERY YEAR. Cabot Street is a minefield most winters. Side streets are worse. Many of the streets are narrow.
Let’s talk about sidewalks. HOW DOES CABOT PARK and ALL SURROUNDING streets NOT HAVE SIDEWALKS. Really? Kids actually get stuck in the mud around Cabot.
Let’s talk about paths through the park. THERE ARE NONE. Nothing hardscaped. So in the winter, you can’t cut through the park. And the park has few sidewalks around its perimeter.
Let’s talk about the MBTA station you mention. That is a commuter rail station. If you live anywhere outside of the direct west of Newon, this is completely useless. Most of our teachers don’t. No transfers unless you get into Boston and then you are doing a reverse commute, which means no trains in the mornings from Boston. That’s bloody useful.
Let’s talk about the buses. 553 and 558 stop within 1/2 a mile. As do various other buses. But they come very infrequently during the day. Our Newton bus system is barely adequate for express routes to Boston. To our surrounding neighborhoods, worse than useless.
Bikes are great, but teachers and teacher aides have materials. I see them lugging in banker boxes full of stuff.
I’ll be posting more on the meeting itself, but public transit doesn’t really work for this site. I wish it did. I really do. But it is a commercial activity vs a residence, and folks aren’t commuting to a hub. Austin streets folks are likely to work in Boston, so the commuter rail is at least useful, as are the bus lines. Teachers and aides are coming TO Cabot from a very wide area.
That isn’t to say there isn’t another solution on the surrounding streets. But many of those surrounding streets have been rather unfriendly to such solutions in the past. Sounds like they are now going to go to a managed parking plan.
I’ll write more about this later, but the project management function in Newton seems fundamentally broken to me. The city seems to have many fiefdoms, and little leadership. We are going to build a 45 million dollar school, and create an even bigger parking problem. Unbelievable.
I can’t tell you how disappointed I was in the aldercritters and the mayor after that meeting. More on that to come.
And Colleen, you kinda contradict yourself. No parking lot for Cabot, but a complaint about too many cars surrounding Carr despite the parking lots. Kinda proves my point (and the school’s point) that parents/teachers/aides/volunteers add up to a lot of needed spaces. You’ve got 70 spaces and a problem. Cabot will have 28 SPACES. Can you imagine the problem for us?
FYI, Colleen, congrats on the NAC win.
I’ll write more on the park, the Park and Rec process, and the meeting later today.
Thank you for putting up the thread.
Fig, you hint at some elements of a good plan. Parking management. Improve the neighborhood with hardscaped paths and sidewalks through and around the park, with spaces along the park side of East Side Parkway, improvements for park users as well as those going to school. Get a bit more serious about snow clearing, or at least have a zero-tolerance for uncleared paths adjacent to the school (clear parking lots are a requirement for school opening procedures, why not pedestrian approaches?) Alternatively, we give up and crush as many cars as possible into the school site, encourage everyone to drive and drop off as close to the building as possible, and are stuck with more gridlock and chaos for the next 80 years.
Adam:
The school estimates that with the expansion the need is for at least 90 spots. Even in the biggest plan all that was being provided was 56. You need your initial fixes regardless.
And let me be honest, I don’t trust the city to actually DO the various fixes. A parking lot is a permanent construction fix for a large portion of the problem.
As for your last 4 lines, I guess it is possible that the parking lot beings gridlock and chaos. But not really sure how you jumped to that. It is a 28 space lot, in addition to 28 surface spaces. The park taking was something like 2.5% of the park.
I have certainly heard lots of folks wish more of us walked our kids to school, or that the kids walk to school themselves. A lot do. But a fair amount of parents work, in the winter that doesn’t work as well, and I live far enough away that my 1st grader has trouble with the walk in rainy or snowy weather. Plus those of us with younger babies as well as school age kids can’t always walk everyone. Plus the disabled. Plus the times there are school projects or events, etc.
A lot of what I want to talk about is the commission meeting, which I found to be very frustrating. I think most of the other parents were equally frustrated. Does anyone know how folks are appointed to the Parks and Rec commission?
Fig, sorry my rant was unclear. I believe it’s the drop-off loops (here, in conjunction with parking) which are the real culprit. Yes, staff and student/parent transportation are related, and yes, many of these people will drive some or all of the time, but it doesn’t mean we have to follow the ATM/drive-thru model. Staff parking across the park would be far more attractive if served by better pedestrian infrastructure. Most working parents with kids who can or will not be able to walk from home can drop off their kids half a block away or more. It might even benefit the parents to do so
Looking forward to hearing more about the meeting.
I went to the meeting and I was VERY disappointed in the process and the outcome. Right off the bat, I had a bad feeling as the meeting seemed to be more run by the School Building Team than the Parks & Rec Commission. Add to that that there was no request to not clap or cheer. While there was only a little booing (deserved as a P&R C made a very poor comment about the real world), clapping for one point or the other does seem to create a more adversarial atmosphere. And of course the outcome with the P&R Commission approving the drop-off loop and keeping the idea of a parking lot on the table if the city can’t come up with a better plan was not the decision I had hoped they would reach. There is no incentive for the School Design Team to put the effort into a managed parking plan when they can apparently strong arm the P&R Commission into giving up the land.
What do I think they should have done? I think they P&RC might have over stepped their bounds. Beth Wilkerson of the Newton Conservators pointed out in her comments that the law requires any “shared use” of a park facility to be to the EQUAL benefit of the park and the other user. Second they should have considered the elements of the plan separately as follows:
1. The closing of Parkview. This is connection is an improvement that will benefit both the park and the school. I had hoped the Commission would approves this.
2. The emergency access. I would challenge the architects to look again for options to shift the gym or swap it with less intrusive elements, to reduce/remove need to have emergency access over the parkland. Of course if it can’t be moved, than I hope the Commission would approve it as it would be required to have Parkview be closed.
3. The drop-off loop. This requires parkland and DOES NOT in any way benefit the park. In fact this takes away from the park. During school arrival and dismissal this will draw likely 40+ vehicles into a tight space around a corner and it is way too easy to see how this design can become a complete gridlock situation. The park and the school would be MUCH SAFER at all times if the number of vehicles coming into this area was minimal. This loop is prioritizing vehicle drop-off over pedestrians and those using the park. I hope the Commission WOULD NOT approve it.
4. Parking strip. This does still take some parkland but seems like a reasonable accommodation that compensates for the lost parking from closing Parkview and with some benefit to the park for vehicles coming from the west side of the neighborhood. The 28 spaces used here could be increased maybe up to 10 more spaces (?) if the drop off loop is not there. I hope the Commission would approve it.
5. Parking lot. Given the already sizeable number of spaces in the strip, the number of spaces that can be found in nearby locations and the ripple effect of moving things within the park, the cost and environmental impact of another paved space, this seems like something that is not necessary. This does not benefit the park as it will likely provide more parking than is necessary. I hope the Commission WOULD NOT approve it.
So what do we think will happen next?
For parent drop-off, small improvements to East-Side Parkway and Bridges could make these great blue zones, that should function much better those currently on the Cabot site plan. The designed loop on Parkview is fundamentally inferior to a straight away drop zone especially as drivers will not be able to see it is congested until they come down Norwood too late to choose another place to go. A single parked car could lead to true gridlock. The other blue zone on Cabot which was not discussed as it did not involve parkland will be a traffic nightmare and pedestrian hazard. In the plans sent to the state SBA the design team admits that this design will not work as designed without help: “It is also recommended that school staff actively manage the drop-off/pick-up areas to provide for safe and efficient operations. A traffic detail should be used to actively manage the Cabot Street blue zone to provide the most efficient operations at the driveway and along the roadway”
Anyone familiar with our schools knows, staff at most schools DOES NOT MANAGE the blue zone (why would you when parents are likely to curse at you?) and certainly the NPD cannot send over details to deal with traffic flows.
I am surprised by all the extra parking that is needed at the schools for non staff visitors. However, near Carr School there is plenty of street parking. What I object to and am quite concerned about is the Nevada, California intersection. So many people visiting the school park on Nevada on the north/west side of the traffic light and this compromises the safety of pedestrians and autos both crossing and turning.
Visitors to the school park there because it is close to the building. In the winter the visitors continue to park there when turning is almost impossible.
So my suggestion is that non staff people might use some discretion when choosing places to park. Even if this means walking a farther distance and not jamming in close to the school entrances.
I believe Angier Parents were given maps of close by places to park when coming to visit. People are inherently lazy when it comes to parking. They will run 10 miles but won’t walk a block if they can park closer. They will spend 10 minutes looking for the perfect parking spot when they could have parked at a further spot and spent 2 minutes walking. I live next door to a tennis club. People drive to the club and work hard to get the spaces right in front of the club or my house. They are coming to exercise but can’t be bothered to walk 60 feet. Patrons of the dog groomer around the corner cause similar issues. These are people who are out walking their dog a few times a day, but park in the setback at the corner, creating a huge safety issue for pedestrians and drivers, because they can’t be bothered to walk 200 feet from the legal parking spaces.
When we build structures, it is perfectly reasonable for the people using the structure to expect a close, convenient place to park. Additionally, if and when parents are stopping by the school to be helpful (probably carrying stuff with them), or when there are events of any type, they should not have to spend time hunting around for a space.
Fig, hence my pre-emeptive disclaimer “not everyone…” I get it – not everyone can walk or bike. Same goes in our household with a 6-miles-to-Brown commute.
But consider this: “Modeling by Deakin and Harvey (1998) indicate that a percentage reduction in urban vehicle mileage tends to produce about twice the percentage reduction in traffic congestion delays.” – http://www.vtpi.org/tdm/tdm96.htm
Those lucky few who can walk or bike disproportionately help ease traffic congestion and parking burden. Let’s increase infrastructure to encourage walking/biking rather than increase infrastructure to encourage more single occupancy driving.
The other thing no one is talking about is the transportation sharing economy, like the SPOT parking app like SPOT and carpooling apps like NuRide or Carma. These are scaling like uber and lyft – Newton needs to be building for the future rather than the present.
Charlie, sure, that’s the ideal, but we live in Newton with highly constrained and expensive resources, and buildings designed on lots 100 years ago. There must be limits on your statement. Are you suggesting that there should be parking lots to accommodate every set of parents in the school? We had a back-to-school night at South last night. People had to park for a 1/4 radius around the school. Going anywhere near the parking lots was a bad idea. Should we pave over the field so everyone can park for school events? And at some point, creating parking comes down to real estate or opportunity costs, as it did at Zervas. How much is a parking space worth?
Parking management can help. For example, blue zones can provide short-term parking during the day for part-time staff and parents.
Brookline has even more expensive real estate and even smaller parking lots, I think. How do they manage?
As long as the mayor and the SC continue to deal with each school renovation individually, the traffic problems will continue to be a major impediment to success for each project as it has been so far with Angier, Zervas and now Cabot. The mayor and the SC refuse to add a 16th elementary school even when given the opportunity to acquire the Aquinas property while planning to relinquish the current Horace Mann location.
If these new bigger schools were being built to address the organic growth within each neighborhood, that would be one thing. However these bigger building are being built expecting the added enrollment to come from farther away thus eliminating the walkability / bike riding option, and causing increased traffic problems for the neighborhoods.
I think the folks who are objecting to the loop either don’t have kids in Cabot (or if they did, never actually spent any time at the Cabot playground at the park). Let me explain why the loop is important.
Cabot School and Cabot Park are neighbors. But Cabot Park is what lawyers would call an attractive nuisance. It sits across from the school, but not connected TO the school. And that’s the rub.
I’ve been at Cabot School for a number of years now. My kids are heavy users of the playground after hours, my kids are heavy users of the Park. A lot of the folks who commented at the meeting were neither. One of the speakers at the meeting accused the parents of using their kids as human shields in order to take over the park. Various commissioners who voted against (or cowardly abstained after objecting constantly during the meeting) said that their mission was to preserve the parks of the city. With all due respect, that is only a portion of that mission, which was clarified back in the 1990s to include the recreation needs of the populace as well. But every park in the city in its core function should be SAFE. If it isn’t safe, the park isn’t being preserved properly, now is it’s recreational use being honored. Many Newton Parks have parking, all of which had to be included after the fact from the original use of the Park. Cold Spring Park has a large parking lot. So does Abermale. Newton Center does not, but lots of folks can park at the nearby school and walk over.
Cabot School has an amazing resource next door, but I’ve been a firsthand witness to several close calls on the street between the school and the park. The teachers are vigilent, the parents are watchful, but left as is eventually there will be an accident. balls go from the blacktop to the street, kids see their friends playing softball and cross over, kids running late to school cut through the park. There needs to be a direct connection, which means closing Parkview, which means putting in the loop.
So most of the parents and many of the teachers who spoke at the meeting spoke in favor of the loop and the closing of Parkview. And many of the speakers, very passionate all, seemed far older and less aware of the actual space or the issues in general. What they cared about was LOSS OF PARKLAND. The city stressed safety, and the compromise to approve the loop but deny the parking lot at the very least put the safety of the students at the same level as the parkland.
Alicia, with all due respect, all of your solutions keep the park separated from the school. I believe I speak for the vast majority of Cabot parents when I say that is a non-starter. Yes the loop is not ideal. Yes it takes 0.9% of the Park (along with the front in parking spaces. But the dozens of parents and teachers who spoke are not being dramatic when we talk about the danger here.
I’ll also note that by connecting the school to the Park, the PARK is improved. It now has access to a playground. And the park’s primary users are children. Right now, the Park fails badly in providing an ideal park for those primary users. The tot lot is somewhat run down, and it is in the middle of the park, away from the older kids playgrounds. Unlike most other parks in Newton, the tot lot is rarely used at Cabot because of this. A huge portion of parents have kids of different ages, and at Cabot, you can have them use the playground at the same time. Makes NO sense. We can fix this if the city is smart. Heck, maybe we can finally get a sprinkler park, like EVERY CITY AROUND US.
It is disappointing to me that so many of the folks who want to preserve the park haven’t spent much time over the past decade advocating for IMPROVING the park. Cabot has a good little league area, but the fields are in very bad shape, the tot lot is isolated and run down, and the playground is….at Cabot, across a street.
It does have a nice new dog lot though. That is the one portion of the park that seems to get used during the day. Park is very empty until school get out or baseball/softball starts, unlike Newton Center or Nonantum parks. Why? Because THOSE PARKS ARE USER FRIENDLY.
I’ve got some more things to say about the meeting but that will have to happen later in the evening.
Name one large park in Newton without a parking lot.
Fig, you failed to explain why the loop is important. So much of what you say makes sense to me except this:
Connect the school and the park. Absolutely. Create a second drop-off blue zone with a very short place to queue before traffic invariably backs up and ends up in gridlock? No. You can have it both ways. Close Parkview and remove the loop.
I’m not up to speed on this whole situation, but I had kids at Cabot. No other school in the city has as serious a safety situation as Cabot does with Parkview being open to traffic while children are playing outside on the blacktop as well as using the fields in the park. It’s been an issues for decades and with the renovation coming up, it’s time to fix it.
Curious whether any abutters on Parkview have expressed opinions on this. Just from viewing an overhead of the area, it would seem to me that it would be beneficial to abutters on both Bridge Street and Parkview if those streets were two-way, (terminating before the Cabot School.) Having suffered many years of blue zone headaches, I now make a point of avoiding them at all costs!
@Jane, great insight and commentary.
Randy: Newton Centre Playground.
@Nathan, Mason Rice School parking lot.
Randy: Hyde playground. Lincoln. Stearns. Richardson. Pellegrini. River Street. Maybe more. Not saying it’s ideal.
Randy…
@Farlow Park
Adam, Cabot Park is 11 acres. I consider most all of the ones you listed as pocket parks. Richardson and Lincoln are 5 acres, so they are a little close to being compared to the large parks around the city. Pellegrini is large, but it does have a parking lot that was just recently repaved. I was referring to large parks like Aburdale Cove, Forte, Lower Falls, Upper Falls, Albemarle(head in parking and shared parking with HM), Bobby Braceland, Cold Springs, Highlands, Nahanton, Farlow, Burr, etc. All of these either have parking lots, or share lots with adjacent schools. I just think that any large park, especially those that are more active than passive, should have parking lots. I respect those on the other side of this issue, this is just my opinion.
Janet, Farlow Park has the small lot at Underwood School and nights and weekends the small lot at the old Newton Corner Library.
Why aren’t multistory parking garages an option? I would think the teachers would LOVE them since they’d be able to carry their heavy loads in a covered space.
Has any thought been given to making East Side Parkway one-way, and using the freed up space for parking along its length?
To Fig and everyone else. My recommendation still stands.
YES to closing Parkview
NO to the loop on Parkview
Somehow the project planners have people convinced that you have to have the loop in order to close the street. You don’t. The loop actually reduces the size of the connection and brings more moving vehicles up against the park. This is a bad idea.
Do you know that one version of the school site plan had either a tot lot or k-2 playground right next to the loop? Anyone with kids knows that is a horrible idea.
to Dan
East Side Parkway is wide enough to accomodate Parking on one side and through traffic both ways and this is probably best for the neighborhood. Moving parking to the park side allows for more cars and less conflict with parking.
Lisa
There were several abutters who spoke at the meeting. They were not in favor of the parking lot and the Parkview abutter who spoke early was extremely unhappy about the idea of the turn around. Of course he is. This is not going to work.
To Barbara
Multistory garages are expensive. No need to take my word for it. MIT landscape architecture and planning professor Eran Ben-Joseph as published in his book, ReThinking a Lot: The Design and Culture of Parking.
The average parking lot cost is $4,000 per space, with a space in an above-grade structure costing $20,000, and a space in an underground garage $30,000-$40,000.
Read more at: http://grist.org/cities/500-million-reasons-to-rethink-the-parking-lot/
Dan, that, or just moving parking to the park side for more spaces with better park access, or even carving out some head-in spaces like Albemarle and leaving East Side Parkway two-way. Lots of possibilities to explore.
Adam, given the road is relatively wide, as per Alicia, making it one way might allow for parking on both sides?
Am I missing something? Is moving the parking to the parkside of East Side Parkway a problem?
Moving parking to the park side of east side parkway would mean residents would have to park across the street which some may like (as that means people won’t block their driveways) and some may hate. Ideally you would put in a sidewalk. Most definitely should put in a paved path through the park. Will the city or the schools be willing to pay for them?
@Alicia is making excellent points!
Thank you Emily. Does anyone think the P&R Commission will be challenged for their vote on this? I don’t see how the approved plan is equally beneficial to the park.
I guess it was all a dream.
Seriously people, are you missing the key points on purpose?
Moving 450 students from the ages 5-11 ACROSS a street in an emergency situation is difficult in the best of circumstance. Teachers/aides/staff having to use their bodies as human shields against traffic to cross kids during recess and school events (PE class, picnics, etc) is not the answer. Stopping traffic to constantly pick up balls that bounce from the playground is not safe.
When members of the board stood up before comments to denigrate teaching staff and make it clear their minds were made up is not due process. The one abutter that spoke up early is trying to have the whole renovation stopped, not just the issue regarding Parkview.
As far as parking on Eastside Parkway goes, there is no hardscape path through the park so during bad weather – rain, snowfall, etc, to make your way across the park is ridiculous, never mind while carrying professional gear. Given the City of Newton does a half-assed plow job on Parkview and doesn’t plow the sidewalks (as someone guiding kids over insanely high ice banks last year, it’s a miracle no one was hurt), it’s not a viable option.
Joining the park to the school means the playground moves to that space between the two areas, making it more accessible to the public. That means during things like Little League and soccer games, parents can allow younger children to play on the play structures while older siblings are playing sports. It means that safe crossing for students, especially in emergency situations.
It’s time to acknowledge that parents do NOT respect blue zones, students don’t walk like they used to, most teaching staff do not live in the community and need to drive to work. The Newton of many peoples’ youth no longer exists and to continue to make decisions on memories that wax nostalgic is ridiculous.
I’ll also note a few things:
1) The viewpoints of the Parks and Rec commission members might be a little skewed due to the fact that very few of them have kids in school. Or use the parks for baseball/basketball/soccer. I think there seems to be a preference for inactive green space vs. activated green space for instance. What is good for a stroll and a picnic is different than what young kids or young adults will use. It would be useful to get a diversity of views and ages on the Parks and Rec Commission.
2) Several of the Parks and Recs folks seem to have adopted a “preserve at all costs” mentality. This is mistake on many levels, but parking seems to be a hot button. I love Joni Mitchell as much as the next guy, but there were far too many “paved paradise to put up a parking lot” references. I’m an environmentalist, but I’m also a realist. With a park the size of Cabot, a parking lot would be a useful addition.
3) Let’s talk about the park itself. As a heavy user, I have to say, it is not in the greatest of shape. It is very inconvenient (perhaps purposefully so) for young families. The tot lot and the playground are not close together, and there is limited to no benches or other seating areas. It is the least busy park for young families as a result. Abermale is always packed on weekend, as is Newton Centre. Cabot Park? Nope. Lots of sport team use, but not many families. And during the week it is empty. Empty. The dog park was a great idea and use, and that gets some daily use which is great.
4) I wish the Newton Conservators and the PArks and Rec folks who cared so passionately about Cabot Park last week would be equally excited to improve the park. Put aside the parking lot for an instant. The city was offering major consessions to improve the park that disappeared with the parking lot being objected. How about the parking lot opponents take on the task of fundraising for those improvements? Or work with parents to improve the park for young kids? This would be a great park for a sprinkler park (it is a cry shame that no park in Newton is a “water” park. And don’t speak to me about how expensive those are, ALL of our neighbors have them. Gath pool is not an alternative.) How about a better tot lot like Newton Center or Sterns? Why are our parks so run down in comparison to our immediate neighbors? Ask any parent who routinely visits Cabot Park, it is simply not user friendly.
5) The meeting itself was a disappointment, partly due to the rhetoric from the Parks and Rec folks who spoke early, partly due to some of the cynical statements of the park supporters. Hey, I get it. Conservation folks feel aggrieved and the process sucked. But accusing parents and teachers of using young children as shields to gain access to the park? Having a temper tantrum because you can’t go beyond your 2 minutes because “multiple members are here” when the school principal also abided by the two minute rule? Calling teachers out because they won’t park 2 or 3 blocks away (when most blocks areound the school are 2 to 3 hour parking). etc etc. I thought the meeting was at least well run by the chair, who seemed pragmatic and a bit tired of herding the band of unique personalities on the commission.
One more thought in my next post.
Finally, and most importantly, I wanted to mention that I was disappointed that Susan Albright spoke against the parking lot. But I do give her credit for speaking, even if her speech was more about the process and the city’s failures than supporting the school and the teachers.
I was very disappointed that Emily Norton did not speak up (at least I never heard her, it is possible she spoke in the first 5 minutes of the meeting). She was there I believe. I have heard that she is not a supporter of closing of Parkview or the parking lot. I have trouble believing that so I’d like to hear that directly from her. Considering what an important issue this is for Cabot parents, I would ask all for Alderman candidates AND Emily to state clearly what there position on this particular issue happens to be. I believe all 5 read this blog. Let’s talk about something OTHER than Austin Street.
As an FYI, I will be relaying all responses on this to the Cabot School PTO as well as a lengthy group of parents via email. I think folks deserve to know where our elected leaders stand. And many of us at Cabot view this as far more important than Austin Street. I know I do. Thanks much.
How many of the commenters actually teach, volunteer, work or have children who attend Cabot? Or have children age 5 to 11 who use Cabot park for more than ball games! How many have children who walk to Cabot? I ask because anyone who does knows closing the road and connecting the school to the park should have been done years ago. There is no way to watch the child playing ball and let the child who doesn’t want to be there be on the playground – across the street. There is no way to have a fun family day in the park while keeping an eye on the child on the tot lot and the one on the children’s playground across the street at Cabot.
Karla and Fig have shown how impossible it is for students, teachers and volunteers.
Now that Cabot school is being built to vastly increase its enrollment to 450 plus all of the new staff needed, it is the perfect time to correct that long standing problem.
Newton is not Urban, regardless of its location so urban studies don’t apply here. Urban areas have schools located near public transportation. That is the public transportation that connects places within its urban location, not the ones that connect outlying residential areas to the urban area, which is basically what Newton has. Cabot is surrounded by parkland and neighborhoods. There are narrow streets, some with no sidewalks. The city doesn’t consider the neighborhood streets and sidewalks a priority. Buses and drop offs will be necessary.
It’s foolish to preach that 28 spaces for cars will be (or even should be) be sufficient. Right now many teachers, volunteers and staff need to drive to work; after the new school is built the numbers will climb steeply. This is not Disney and wishing won’t magically make cars no longer needed in non-urban, residential areas. The cars used by people coming and going from work in these areas will have to be parked and with the new larger enrollment a larger parking lot is necessary. People who live on the neighboring streets should be advocating for the parking lot because they constantly complain about cars parked in front of their houses, understandably.
An elementary school parking lot is not a cause or an issue and should not be usurped by groups for political reasons. Parkland advocates will still have most of the park, made more useable by connecting the park to the playground. No-cars parked ever, anywhere advocates will have to work from the other direction – create an alternative first.
I will say it again. Close the road! Yes this makes so much sense!!!!
Don’t put a drop loop in! This make little sense (as it is inefficient and likely to gridlock) but mostly it will reduce the safety of the park and the school.
Drop zones can be make on Bridges and East-Side Parkway.
Alicia:
A drop zone on East Side won’t work. That is a lot of real estate for teachers to cover. Maybe for the older kids. Bridges would be possible, as would the Cabot side of the school whre the buses are slated to go. Bridges is narrow though and has houses on two sides. That is going to seriously impact that street and I think they’ve tried to avoid that.
Generally I’ve trusted that the parking and traffic folks have attempted to analyize these possible fixes and found them wanting. But perhaps someone who was on the planning committee can speak up.
Again, I would hope all of the Aldercritter candidates would post their thoughts.
Alicia,
After working in Wellesley for a month, I wish Newton would adopt what they do for school drop off/pick up. Car lines where parents must STAY in the car, pull up to a numbered spot. A staff member assigned to that spot radio into an area where kids are waiting (i.e. “Smith is here for Johnny and Debbie”). The kids come out, staff helps them into the car if necessary, the parent/pick up person pulls out and the next person pulls in. Smooth, simple and pick up is done in 10-15 minutes. The school I work in has a parking turn around like the one proposed at Parkview and there are no gridlocks (even with teachers leaving, they have to leave the teacher lot when there are openings in the car line traffic), no pain, no fuss.
That won’t happen in Newton without a policy change.
When my boys were little, parents didn’t respect the blue zone. They didn’t when I worked for Newton schools. I doubt they ever will until someone puts their foot down and starts ticketing parents in meaningful way.
Fig, you haven’t made a very convincing case that drop off and pick up on East Side (or some combination of East Side and Bridges) wouldn’t work. With the exception of the youngest kids, and only at dismissal, blue zone operation should not even involve teachers. Teachers should be working with our kids, not directing traffic.
Karla, I agree. Blue zones suck. (Parents are supposed to STAY in their cars and follow rules now, yet they typically do not. Maybe we’re just “special” in Newton?) It’s not clear the designers were suggesting anything other than blue zones, but I hope that any design would encourage and even put priority on the non-trivial number of students who still do walk, and seek to preserve or increase that number. Having some portion of the population not arrive and leave by car is the best way to make arrival and dismissal work. Alternatives which require more staffing and more policing sound even less “sustainable” to me.
Here, we have the opportunity to design sustainable buildings. Let’s not design traffic jams or driveways which add a burden on our teaching staff, for decades to come. Distributing the traffic pattern away from the school could help reduce congestion. Drawing it close would do just the opposite.
@Fig, sorry for the delay in responding, I am just seeing your post now. (Greg maybe we can get a new blog feature where I get an email when my name is mentioned!) I support closing Parkview to all but emergency vehicles as a way to increase safety. I do not support building a parking lot in the park. This should not surprise anyone as I also did not support spending $2M to knock down 3 homes to build a parking lot for the new Zervas School, when Cold Spring Park’s parking lot is right there.
I walk 10 min to a train, then I walk 10 min to my office from South Station, in all kinds of weather, carrying heavy stuff. While I get that staff might WANT to have a parking lot right next to the school, that is not the same as NEED. One of the speakers at the hearing said she would not feel “safe” walking to or from Cabot to her parked car on an adjoining street. That one just made me scratch my head… one can complain about the condition of our roads and sidewalks, one can complain that residents should trim their bushes better (as covered in my most recent e-newsletter), but I think walking along any of streets around Cabot School at 6AM or 6PM is a pretty safe activity.
I did not speak at the Parks and Rec hearing because I kept waiting to see a presentation by the School Department or administration demonstrating all the various parking options aside from building a parking lot on Cabot Park. I was disappointed not to see such a presentation and I have communicated to the various parties that I would like to see such a presentation as soon as possible. I know that these conversations are going on (such as using Cabot Park Village, creating angled parking on East Side Parkway, etc.), they’re just not going on at public meetings, at least so far.
We don’t have enough green space in our City. There will always be an excuse to chip away here and there at the small amount that we have. I don’t think we should do that, and I’m glad previous generations left us what we have.
Right on, Emily!
Thank you Karla for your comments regarding the blue zone. You’re right – the city needs to ticket and ticket very harshly in the blue zone. On the rare occasions officers do come out tickets are not issued. Last year I watched an officer tell a woman to get back into her car. She did until he walked down the street and she promptly got out and left her car again. Guess what, she still leaves her car and why shouldn’t she? What matter is it to her if people look crossly at her? She gets what she wants, namely personal convenience.
We are a newton centre family. I got a non-blue zone parking ticket the day I spent volunteering inside my kid’s elementary school. I’m not complaining about it but an hour later, I leave the school and it’s chaos out there. People doing all sorts of crazy things: jay walking with small kids in bumper to bumper traffic so they don’t have to walk a few feet to the cross walk is a good one. Or leaving their cars idling in the MIDDLE of the street, not even in the blue zone, while they go locate their kid and/or blocking in the school bus are also good ones.
My ticket was issued at 2pm. The city could have sent traffic control at 3pm and would have gotten many, many more violators aside from my lousy $20 ticket. You can bet I’ll be more careful next time. Our principal regularly admonishes people and sends out letters to parents asking them to follow safety procedures but NOTHING changes. Maybe an expensive ticket or two will change behaviour.
I honestly do not understand how the NPD can periodically set up pedestrian crossing stings and not do blue zone stings at the schools. It literally makes no sense to me.
@Alicia Thanks for the parking costs link. The City paid $3 million to buy the 3 properties on Beacon to tear down for 64 parking spaces at Zervas. If a parking structure was built instead, the cost would have been $20K x 64=$1.28 million, or less than half the price we paid.
I honestly don’t understand the reluctance to use garages in these situations.
There is abundant parking in the neighborhood; it’s just not currently available. But in the 21st century we have solutions we hadn’t had before. People drive out of their driveways to work leave shortly before teachers arrive to park in their driveways. Teachers depart before the homeowner-commuters return home. This can/should be happening at Cabot, Zervas, Angier, every school. http://www.parkeasier.com/ is one app.
The city could even subsidize this with money it would otherwise spend building and maintaining a parking lot.
@Barbara don’t forget to add in the cost of the property to build the parking garage. That would add $1 million to your cost.
Actually it is worse than $3 million for 64 spaces. We paid $3 million for 15 or so spaces , as there were plans that would have had something like 40 spaces in the current lot of Zervas by pulling the building forward a bit and tucking more parking behind the building. I think some of the alderman referred to the $3 million giving the lot more breathing room. What if we looked to the neighborhood that has many WIDE streets and assigned some parking to teachers could we have only bought 2 houses or 1 or none?
These buildings will be here long after I am dead and I plan on living another 40+ years. We need to design them to accommodate the new reality of reducing our use of paved spaces, encouraging less driving and supporting more walking and biking. If we were going to spend $3 million I think we could have found many great projects in neighborhood that would benefit so many, better paths in Cold Spring, improved sidewalks and crossings, and more trees to name a few.
@ joyce. ticketing during arrival and dismissal is a good idea that has been suggested many times (although I don’t think it will really change behavior but there does seem to be a need to have some consequences for breaking the rules). The problem is that 100% of the traffic control officers (eg. meter maids) are crossing guards as well. So there isn’t anyone available to do this.
As for the pedestrian stings, these are paid for 100% by grants from the state.
This City has me so depressed. There is just no leadership, no innovation, no outside-the-box thinking, no cooperation from residents. That story about the parent waiting for the officer to leave so she could park in the blue zone is so typical of Newtonian’s entitled behavior.
And wasn’t the third override supposed to get us more police officers so the rules and regulations around schools could be enforced? Instead it bought us a $3+ million Zervas parking lot (not to mention the $40+ million school)
@Nate: Neighborhood parking can/should happen all over the City, not just around schools. I live near the Highlands T stop. Good luck trying to park near the station so you can use public transportation.
For a City so full of thoughtful, accomplished people, it is a very depressing place.
Emily, with all due respect, this is your ward. Cabot is your school (or one of your schools). This school renovation is one of the most important things that will happen in this ward in the next 20 years. I’ve seen you devote a lot of time and energy to Austin Street, and to renaming the counsel. Fine, that is what you are passionate about. But you state you didn’t speak at the meeting (many of the other aldercritters spoke) to advocate publicly because you were waiting for a presentation from the school department on the various parking options? There have been multiple meetings of the Cabot building committee group. This proposal (no lot, or 28 spaces, or new lot) didn’t come out of thin air. If I knew about the various options, and at least a basic understanding of the issues with parking on the streets surrounding the school, you should too. (or you should have at least come prepared for the meeting so you could have…well…led.).
As for the portion of your post regarding that you walk 10 minutes to the train and ten minutes to work carrying heavy belonging…congratulations. So do I. I also occasionally pay for parking. It all stinks. But folks that visit my office are given subsidized parking, or free parking. Are you suggesting that the parents and volunteers at the school should walk 10 minutes? Are you suggesting that the various specialists that visit multiple schools should search 10 minutes for parking? Is that the best use of their time?
How about during the winter? When the streets around the school turn into mud, then ice, then massive snow piles. My kids often walk to school. They can’t during the winter because of the poor job the city does plowing sidewalks. And streets. Pretty sure your job that you go to has plowed sidewalks. I know mine does.
I’m always happy for preserved green space. I wasn’t thrilled with the incursion into Cabot Park. But I would expect the aldercritters from this Ward to lead on these issues. And it is just not enough to oppose the parking lot and not have an alternative plan.
And for the record, I apply the same standard to Susan Albright. I give her credit for actually being public about her stance, but I expect more from both of you. I echo the remark about a lack of leadership.
Emily, one of the improvements to the park is adding hardscape paths to facilitate walking and lighting. Not only that it would allow people with physical needs (wheelchairs, walkers, strollers, etc.) use of the area they don’t currently have. Moving the softball field gives the players a year or so of a decent field (before it falls into neglect like all the other city fields that don’t have an active community to maintain it like the Little Leagues in Newton). In exchange, less than 3% of the park makes it easier for people working in the building during school days and families at the end of the school day (Little League, using park facilities, soccer, etc.).
The safety issue raised has more to do with, again, lack of upkeep on the city’s part. It’s all well and good when the weather is nice, but bring on the rain and a mud filled field or the snow, it’s not safe. I ended up on crutches and in a brace for six weeks last winter doing playground duty at school standing guard at the over 6+ foot snow banks left by the plows (after they knocked over two of the poles separating the blacktop from the play area, part of the stone bench under Humpty Dumpty and whatever else they randomly shoved into the pile. As someone who walked to school until I was injured during that time, sidewalks are randomly shoveled. Some people shovel the whole sidewalk, some shovel the width of the shovel blade. Some shovel all the way to the pavement and treat everything with ice melt while others do next to nothing. The sidewalk on Parkview (city property) is left untouched forming a giant ice bank. This leaves people brave enough to forge a walking path across the field from the fence opening on East Side Parkway a large bank to scale and then try to get down the other side.
That’s not safe for anyone. That’s before you factor in the drivers who run the stop signs on Cabot, ignore pedestrians in the crosswalks and more. Unless and until the city decides to address those factors, it’s an unsafe area for a community that doesn’t provide workers’ comp to their municipal employees.
@fig, I must correct you. There has not been a public presentation of the options for parking, even if a parking lot were to be built in the park. (Even a 28 car parking lot does not meet the 90+ car demand as described by the principal.) We have heard discussions are going on with Cabot Park Village, we have heard there could be more spaces along East Side, but there had been no formal presentation of the kind we usually get at Traffic Council for example. Our staff generally do an excellent job laying out options so I am eager to see this.
Emily, staff has enough to do. Why isn’t the design firm we’re paying the $$ presenting alternatives?
@Adam: I really don’t care who presents the information, I just want someone to do it.
At Karla. the city doesn’t pay worker’s compensation? I thought all companies were required to provide worker’s comp? I believe the city probably self insures as they do with medical insurance. But may be someone else can weigh in here that keeps track of the city’s financial detail.
I wonder if it is legal to transfer the use of this land without the Parks+Recreation Department declaring the land surplus with Commissioner DeRubeis passing the land back into the Newton muni-owned acreage ‘pool’. This way Cabot School parking lot may be the new designated land use of this “surplus” land with a 2/3 vote of the Board of Aldermen.
Are there any legal eagles here able to interpret EOEA Article 97 Land Disposition Policy?