In an oped column in the TAB, John Koot and Isabelle Albeck of the newly formed group Newton Villages Alliance write….
Whether they have been living here for decades or recently moved here, most residents chose Newton precisely for its suburban qualities, not because they hope to see it grow ever more urban.
Since I’m not aware of any polls or research that have been conducted on this question, I’m guessing Koot and Albeck have reached that conclusion based on their own anecdotal evidence or hunch.
So let’s put out there for discussion.
Why did you, or do you, chose to live in Newton? And do you share Koot’s and Albeck’s fears of becoming like Brookline or Somerville?
We moved to Newton for the schools.
I share their concerns about how the zoning regulations unintentionally provide great incentives to knock down modest and affordable houses and replace them with much larger, much more expensive houses that don’t fit with the surrounding housing.
I don’t share their concerns about the “urbanization” of Newton.
Moved here for the schools, the large Jewish community (more for my wife than myself), and the nor horrible commute into Boston for a job I no longer have. I have found the schools to be adequate with my kids high school, South, a bit more impressive. Newton is by no means great and certainly not worth the premium it costs to live here. While I have made many very good friends in Newton, I find governance to be at best mediocre. The whining, complaining, and desire to regulate what private property owners do with their private property is, IMNSHO, despicable.
If people are concerned about the fate of trees, the construction of larger houses next to theirs (McMansion is a pejorative that should be stricken from common parlance), and such, they should band together, purchase the property for themselves and keep it just as it is. Otherwise, the guiding principle of the city should be to do minimal damage and have minimal involvement in what people do with what they have earned. That so many people flout the zoning regs and seek permission after violation is a pretty clear indication that these rules are not meeting the needs of the populace.
Perhaps not surprisingly, my primary objective vis a vis Newton is to maximize the worth of my house with the expectation of quickly departing to either a more urban or vastly more rural setting for my retirement.
Location, location, location.
We spent a lot of time looking in B’line because I preferred the school system and a closer to Boston, but we couldn’t afford it. As it turns out, we’ve been extremely happy in Newton and chose to stay after our kids moved on and into our so-called retirement years. I was pleased to sell our home to a young family who love it as much as we did, and after a long search, we were fortunate to find a house that suits our present needs.
If I may put in a good word for Somerville – we lived there for a number years and really loved it as well. It was a hoppin’ place even back in the day and it’s only gotten better over time – and they have a great mayor and Congressman. We would have stayed there forever if it hadn’t been for the school system and the difficult commute.
Everything Jerry said about NVA.
Jerry,with all due respect,.. Do you really understand what the term “urbanization” means ?
To my mind it suggests a densification of a living environment. Densification of a place like Newton implys a change of character that Koot and Albeck are warning against. With density and urbanization comes a loss of tree canopy and even more automobile traffic and parking problems. And with density and character / image change come increased school enrolments , larger lower quality schools, higher taxes and ultimately , reduced real estate values.
This I believe is their argument.
We CHOSE to move to Newton 25 years ago for the schools and for the easy walk to the T station to commute to work and school.
Greg, I think you CHOSE the incorrect wording. The correct question is:
Why did you CHOOSE to live in Newton (past tense) or Why do you choose to live in Newton (present tense) – The response can use the word CHOSE, as in I chose Newton for the neighborhood villages.
@Jo-Lousie: I used “chose” because that’s the word Koot and Albeck used in their column. And I think it’s relevant to invite people to explain not just why they decided to live here but also why they stay.
Greg, the point of this discussion is to hear reasons why people chose (past tense) to reside in Newton, or why people choose (present tense) to reside in Newton.
Here is the quote from the Op-Ed:
Most residents CHOSE Newton precisely for its suburban qualities, not because they hope to see it grow ever more urban.
I interpreted that by context that it was past tense. Even if I misinterpreted it, and it was intended to be “choose”, you don’t have to use their wording. I have come to admire your writing, and I am just being picky about the way you wrote this heading.
Ha. OK, thanks Jo-Louise. I guess we chose to see it differently.
Okay, Greg.
I can choose to agree to disagree politely with your choice of chose.
Thanks!
Regarding urbanization, instead of personal interpretations, it would be extremely helpful to have this discussion in the context of Newton’s Comprehensive Plan. Hopefully, interested parties have read the document. It specifically recommends
while carefully preserving the residential character of our neighborhoods. Reducing the tax burdens, to preserve services everyone cares so much about without the constant threats of overrides, amazingly hasn’t come up in the discussion. Nobody is proposing urbanizing the entire city. Not even close.
To be on the T, walking distance to shops, close to 128 (I was going to Providence 2x/week at the time), Jewish community, close to family. I did not want someplace too suburban feeling (was escaping west-of-128 suburbs where I’d lived when married).
We moved here before we had kids, but we knew once we had kids this was where we wanted to be for the kids.
1. Easy access to Boston and the Pike.
2. Active Jewish Community – future children would not be the only one in their school
3. Great local community
4. Good Schools
5. Larger population than a town with more diversity (both economical and global)
We have had great great teachers (a few not great ones) but the condition of Angier was unbelievable. I am still not happy with the “quality” of the school lunches. While I enjoy the visiting salad bar, the prepared meals for the elementary schools are disgusting. I am not happy with the response to the growing school population (my son was at the start of the bubble and was never in a class that had 20 kids – always 25).
I enjoy the public library and the community feel in Waban and Newton Highlands. I love the Highlands village center and especially Green Planet, and LOVE New England Mobile Book Fair.
Love how I live close enough to walk to a green line station and as my kids get older, they will benefit from it also.
I am happy with my neighborhood (amazing neighbors).
Disappointed in the growing number of HUGE homes and townhouses. Concerned that we are getting too dense between AVALON on Needham Street, and the proposed Riverside Development. Concerned about increasing traffic and increasing potholes and streets that are riddled with potholes. Concerned with the water pipes.
But still glad I moved here.
Reasons why we chose to move to Newton in no order of significance:
-3 generations of family raised here;
-low crime rate;
– good schools;
– strong property values;
– beautiful library;
– easy to be a 1 car family with proximity to Boston and excellent public transportation;
– easy access to many activities for kids.
We chose Newton for the location and the schools, and most definitely not for the suburban character. We lived in Somerville for many years but when I got a faculty position in Worcester, the commute became untenable. We lived in the South End for a few years, but couldn’t afford a large enough place once kids arrived. Looked westward, and Newton made sense.
Newton made sense for us because it had great transportation for our jobs in downtown Boston and Worcester, but wasn’t just a bedroom community. We live in Newtonville and love being able to walk to grocery stores, restaurants, the train station, etc. I love the walkable neighborhood schools and the community they seem to engender. If Newton had been a typical low-density, car-dependent suburb, we would have ended up elsewhere. I’m excited by the prospect of the Austin St. development and an expanded set of businesses to patronize.
We moved here when we were adopting our daughter, so both of us could be in nearer proximity to work, and for the schools. That was 27 years ago and I still like it here. I now live in easy access to Newtonville, without feeling I’m in the midst of an urban center. But I will continue to stay here as much for the nice people I’ve met and know here in Newton.
I agree there is reason for concern with the McMansion craze, but mostly because I don’t like buildings going up that absorb most of the property’s square footage. Aesthetically not pleasing. I also don’t like the perhaps unintended side effects of 40B, but that’s an issue larger than just for Newton.
Adam made a good point when he said “Reducing the tax burdens, to preserve services everyone cares so much about without the constant threats of overrides, amazingly hasn’t come up in the discussion.”
And that is a shame. The reason why there is a constant threat of overrides in Newton is because Newton has a structural spending problem and that very few people are willing to speak about Newton’s budgetary sacred cows.
I was born here, so I really had no say in the matter. That said, I’m glad it happened the way it did and that I’m still here. I probably have as good a memory as anyone else who posts here of what Newton was like from the last years of World War II right up to when I left for the Navy in 1960.. And I’ve also been a close observer and participant here since 1996 when I left Washington D.C. and the Federal Government for good. I wouldn’t have believed you if you told me 35 years ago that I’d still be here in 2014. I was certain I’d retire much further South.
So I’ve seen the past and the present here. Some things were better then and some things are much better now, but whether it was then or now, this is a fantastic and vibrant place to live. We are fortunate to be here and anyone that doesn’t feel that way just hasn’t had the opportunity or the inclination to see and observe what I have over the years. One of the things Jerry Reilly and I have in common is that we see the good here because it’s always there and right before our eyes. The bad is also there and it’s not always as subtle as the good. That’s why it gets so much play. There is so much going on and so much of it is fun, fascinating and free. It’s really a luxury problem when we can get a lot of people debating urbanization vs. preservation and where to put bike and walking trails.
I’m with Jerry when he voices concerns about the construction of large out of place houses in neighborhoods of smaller dwellings and partially with him about not fearing “urbanization” as such. I simply would like to know what the plans for urbanization will entail and I think we should have the courage to see beyond the Comprehensive Plan when it’s goals don’t seem to mesh with reality and events on the ground.
We moved to Newton because of the schools, because of the public transit access to Boston (where I worked at the time), the “best of both worlds” mix of small city and suburban environments. We also felt that this was a community where we already had friends and where we could put roots down ourselves and spend the rest of our lives.
I absolutely share the NVA concerns regarding loss of trees, clearing and leveling residential areas of the City, of buldozing historic and/or characteristic (and often affordable) homes throughout the residential areas in favor of large human warehouse style homes that max out FAR.
But I do not share the concerns regarding urbanization of the village centers. Indeed, I look at the villages as a place where we can learn from the lessons of the past and see what worked when these were places where one could live affordably and walk to shopping, transit or work. Of course, all of this needs to be balanced appropriately, but I don’t think we’re in danger of over urbanization.
My wife and I are third generation Newtonian/Newtonites. You could say that we chose to stay in Newton specifically because of the density. We looked at communities like Needham and Medfield, where it would have been much easier to afford a house, but we opted for a smaller home and yard in a tighter neighborhood, closer to the city. We wanted to live within walking distance to a village and good public transit, and although we’re clearly in the minority, a place where a family can survive with a single car. We wanted our kids to go to the Newton Schools, and we wanted the city managed in such a way that would maintain a top-notch school system (as well as other city services).
We continue to enjoy our village centers, but with the loss of neighborhood pharmacies, grocery stores, movie theaters, and elementary schools, they are not nearly as vibrant as they were when we were kids. We’ve voted for every override, but wished we didn’t have to. We’ve watched our neighborhood and our villages get overrun with traffic, whether generated by local trips or commuters. We know that economic realities, like the costs of pensions and an aging infrastructure, are putting stress on our city. We’d like to see our public resources maximized, especially in our village centers, especially in vacant lots.
We know that there are things about our city that are broken and must be changed. Change is hard.
I was born in Newton and have deep roots here,-my Grandfather was the first President of the Adams street Shul-but after high school graduation I moved to Maine. Years later I met my bride-to-be who was living in NYC at the time but was also originally from Newton (different village and generation- I robbed the cradle). I really don’t like cities and she wasn’t interested in a rural existence. We were both comfortable with Newton and knew it was a good place to raise kids.
Here we are many years later and it was a terrific decision. A great place to raise kids- the schools and environment helped our children flourish.
Now, as other empty nesters are selling out and moving to NewtonEast (the South End), I see no reason to leave. I find suburban life very convenient. A great geographic location, lots of cultural options, the Green Line and best of all, we’ve got terrific neighbors and friends here.
We moved here for the proximity to the city (we are city-lovin’ folk who look East to Boston rather than West to the ‘burbs for our goods and entertainment) and transportation ease in all (ok, most) directions. We previously lived in Somerville, where the rental market in 1998 was ridiculous, especially for a couple expecting a baby.
We stayed for the schools, which we have been largely pleased with (our son is at North after attending Underwood and Bigelow). We were lucky to find a modest house (in size; modest price is relative in Newton, as it will be for such a location) we could afford, that would be manageable for us as empty-nesters.
@blueprintbill
Brookline keeps getting mentioned in connection with the woes of urbanization. Brookline’s got great schools (though yes they are larger). From what I can see they have lower taxes and higher real estate values.
So no, I don’t want to change Newton into Brookline. I’m just pointing out that sensibly planned increased density doesn’t necessarily lead to all the woes you mentioned.
… and yes, I do know what “urbanization” mean
Good point Jerry. Brookline also has wonderful parks, lots of tree-lined streets and yet a much broader diversity of housing options, restaurants, shops and other amenities.
I grew up in Newton and chose to purchase a house here 10 years ago because I love the town and the property values are solid and I have many friends and family here. My fond childhood memories are of open green spaces, lots of great parks and little overcrowding. I would like to preserve the former two but have given up on the latter.
I think the word “urbanization” is subject to much symantic confusion and misunderstandings between all of the groups that want to “preserve” and/or “revitalize” the city.
To be honest, I think the angst has much less to do with what is built and who builds it and much more to do with who is making the decisions and how those decisions are made. I know we are all supposed to “move on” from the NNHS debacle, but that is exactly the type of planning and decision-making “legacy” (fair or not) that is creating all of this lack of consensus and further dividing the community. Have our town economics improved significantly since Mayor Cohen and with the new administration? Depends on who you ask, my opinion is “no” and “maybe going backwards.”
@GT: If you’re worried about our economics, and we all should be, you should be welcoming projects such as Austin Street which are intended to both add vitality to our village centers and more tax revenue to city’s bank account without going back to existing property owners for another override.
And let’s remember, a development at Austin Street doesn’t take away any leafy green streets or backyards. It replaces an ugly old parking lot.
Meanwhile, I do think we’ve moved on considerably from the David Cohen era in terms of our financial stability and the professionalism inside City Hall. I like to think the large margins of victory for last year’s override and in the mayoral election indicate that most voters agree.
I moved to Newton three times, but I won’t bore you with the details. In the meantime, I think that Bob raises a great point: The City has a Comprehensive Plan, which was painstakingly brought forward lo, 4-5 years ago. As I understand it, it calls for the density, or “urbanization” like the Newtonville project. Actually it calls for a lot of things. It is, well, comprehensive. Virtually nobody disagreed with the CP when it was passed. As the CP is City Policy, why then do people now get so upset when it gets implemented?
@Greg I am curious, have you seen any analysis demonstrating that developing the Austin Street lot will be a financial net positive for the City?
@Emily: I’ve read the RFP which lists “substantial net positive fiscal benefit to the city” as a key objective.
But maybe I should have begun by asking you: Have you seen an analysis suggesting otherwise?
Given that we’re only now beginning negotiations, I guessing no such analysis either way exists yet.
I have not seen one either way, which is why I asked.
PS I’m with Jo-Louise… the laws of grammar dictate it should read “choose”
+1 choose
Do I read right? Appendix G says that the land was “taken” in 1947 (by eminent domain?) for use as a parking lot??
Pros
1. Great Schools
2. Low Crime
3. Great Location
4. Open Space (Parks)
Cons
1. City Hall
2. Too lopsided in democratic party affiliation (Cambridge-esque)
3. Poor road maintenance
Like Bob Burke, I’m probably here mainly because my parents chose to move here from Scituate in the late 1950s. If they’d chosen someplace similarly situated like Arlington or Belmont, I might very well be there, ceteris paribus.
Why did they pick Newton? I used to think it was for the schools, but since the first thing they did when my younger sister finished kindergarten was to send us to St. Bernard’s (which did not have K), I think it may have had more to do with the Corps of Engineers, where my father worked, moving from Boston to Waltham. That, and my mother’s sisters living in Brighton.
I returned after a few years of grad school and work in the Midwest (where I never saw myself permanently because it didn’t have an ocean), and couldn’t think of anyplace better than Newton. I like living where I have roots, even if only my own, so I’m lucky that where I grew up also has grass and trees and parks, while I can also walk to WN Cinema in 15 minutes, drive to the Y in 10 or 15 minutes, shop for groceries at any of four places on the way home, and get to the airport (if I travel light) via 30 minute walk and then the T. Convenient access to highways is also a big plus: getting into Boston fast on the Pike when I was still stringing for AP, and being near 128 to get to Lowell. I like being close enough to my neighbors to say hi, but not so close I have to listen to their music.
And Newton is never boring. Lots of interesting people, great programs at the Library (although this is true of many towns that I cover for the Lowell Sun), and many village centers instead of one big one, so wherever you are you’re not too far from one. My big regret is that so many branch libraries had to close. My parents used the West Newton branch library incessantly, and volunteering there was a big part of my mother’s social life in the years before she died.
Well, my wife and I wanted to live in Brookline, couldn’t afford even a condo there of any size, then expanded the search. We loved Newton’s transportation options, loved the village concept (we wanted to live near coolridge corner in Brookline) and liked the schools. So far, so good.
As for urbanization, we really like the mix. I want the village to be lively with activity, and I’d love for the commuter rail to come more often.
No choice, I was born and raised there, third-generation Newtonian.
We initially considered Newton because of its proximity to my husband’s job in Watertown. Plus, I like the city and my husband likes the ‘burbs. West Newton, where we have lived for 9 years, is a nice blend of both. We can walk up the street to go to Paddy’s, CVS, the commuter rail, but we have a small single family home with a driveway and yard.
Sadly, we have long outgrown our tiny home that we purchased pre-kid and can’t afford a bigger single family home in Newton, so we’ll be leaving in a year or two.